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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 10:28 pm 
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Location: melbourne.vic.au
Has anyone fitted a 4 point harness in a 1600 to CAMS requirements without having a cage to mount the shoulder straps to? The lap belts will mount nicely to the existing floor mounts, but the shoulder straps will probably have to mount near the parcel shelf to be below the maximum angle of 40deg from horizontal. If anyone has done this, how did you do it?

The car will be registered on Historic plates in Victoria if that makes a difference.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:21 am 
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Location: brisvegas
not sure if you've seen this http://www.camsmanual.com.au/pdf/genera ... 20Q207.pdf

Quote:
3. MOUNTINGS
The safety harness or seat belt must be securely mounted on at least two points (Type D), three points (Types B and C) or 4 points (Type A). On cars derived from series production vehicles such mountings shall be positioned to provide compliance with the prescriptions shown in Drawings I-1 and I -2. If the two shoulder straps join prior to a common mounting point then that junction shall be at least 150mm behind the wearer?s neck. In all cases of mounting the following must be observed:
(a) On series production cars, some or all of the original seat belt mounting points may be satisfactory. Where the original seat belts are affixed to the seat, such mounting points may be used only:
(i) where the original unmodified mounting points on the seat are retained; and
(ii) the vehicle is being used for non-FIA International events.
Where the original mounting points are not used, additional floor mounting points must be reinforced with a 3mm steel plate of at least 75mm x 50mm on the underside of the body.
(b) Full harness (Type A and B) rear mounting points must be to a substantial part of the vehicle?s structure, reinforced as for floor mounts above, or to the safety cage.
(c) Under no circumstances may a safety harness mounting bolt be used to affix a safety cage to the bodyshell.
I have a cross brace for mounting the harnesses on my car.
I wouldnt be bolting the harnesses to anything except an original seatbelt points without reinforcement, I dont think that fixing to the parcel shelf will cut it either.

ohh and for those with more modern cars dont use those baby capsule mounts, pretty sure they aren't rated for a full size adult.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:03 am 
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Location: melbourne.vic.au
datto-510 wrote:
not sure if you've seen this http://www.camsmanual.com.au/pdf/genera ... 20Q207.pdf

I have a cross brace for mounting the harnesses on my car.
I wouldnt be bolting the harnesses to anything except an original seatbelt points without reinforcement, I dont think that fixing to the parcel shelf will cut it either.

ohh and for those with more modern cars dont use those baby capsule mounts, pretty sure they aren't rated for a full size adult.
I've got a copy of the manual, thanks though. I plan on sandwiching the parcel shelf with two plates using the three captive nuts around the small hole in the shelf, running a strap along the vertical wall under the window behind this, then tying the top sandwich plate to the strap. Conveniently, the vertical wall is tied in to the boot from factory.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 9:14 am 
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actually, thinking about it, my car has 4 holes drilled just below the rear window, so someone has probably had harnesses in it mounted that way at some stage.

if in doubt give cams a ring or email if you want to double check what your doing is ok.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 4:25 pm 
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I have been in two rear enders

When you see how much a rear shelf can move with relatively small impact.

I wouldn't mount harnesses to one.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 7:42 pm 
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Hey Mikan,

does the car not have a cage ?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 11:35 pm 
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datto-510 wrote:
Hey Mikan,

does the car not have a cage ?
No cage yet, this is just a temporary measure until I can get a cage in there.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 8:09 am 
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your original seatbelt should be acceptable at events where a cage isnt required.

have you checked weather you can use the seatbelt mounting points from under the back seat ? .........being historic i suppose that you are keeping the back seat, or is it historic rego, but not historic cams class ? anyway they might make good temporary mounting points until you get the roll cage built.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:24 am 
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Location: melbourne.vic.au
datto-510 wrote:
your original seatbelt should be acceptable at events where a cage isnt required.

have you checked weather you can use the seatbelt mounting points from under the back seat ? .........being historic i suppose that you are keeping the back seat, or is it historic rego, but not historic cams class ? anyway they might make good temporary mounting points until you get the roll cage built.
I'm entering an event that requires a proper harness. It's Historic rego, but not Historic class, so I can remove the back seats. I sit too high to be able to use the lower rear seatbelt mounts and meet the CAMS strap angle requirements.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:31 am 
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SSS_510 wrote:
I have been in two rear enders

When you see how much a rear shelf can move with relatively small impact.

I wouldn't mount harnesses to one.
Did the vertical wall below the rear windscreen move in your rear enders? I agree mounting only to the parcel shelf is a bad idea, that's why I plan to tie into rear windscreen surround and boot as well.


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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2008 2:11 pm 
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Location: Canberra
Sorry to bring up an old topic but is this info still current or have the rules changed?

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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2008 6:41 pm 
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DattoA10 wrote:
Sorry to bring up an old topic but is this info still current or have the rules changed?
The CAMS regs are still the same (still require the mounting of a harness to a significant part of the vehicle structure, reinforced as required).
http://www.camsmanual.com.au/pdf/genera ... I_Q208.pdf
Fit a cage with a harness bar while you're building the car up, it'll be easier in the long run :thumbsup:


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PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2008 1:46 am 
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Brilliant, thankyou :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 10:00 am 
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If anybody needs a new mounting location, klippan sells nice beefy mounts that sandwich the metal between them then rivet together, the thread is on the underside so when you bolt the belt in it clamps tighter. Definitely get advice before chopping your car though.

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PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2011 10:30 am 
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From memory you need to have a 100mm X 100mm (10cm) steel plate 5-6mm thick to mount a seatbelt to. So the plate would be under the parcel shelf. This was a few years ago so prob best to ask an engineer to be sure.

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