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Boost retard on Bluebird Dizzy
http://www.ozdat.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11720		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Aym23q [ Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:05 am ]
Post subject:  Boost retard on Bluebird Dizzy
Hi guys

Just wondering if anyone knows of a place that could help me out setting up my Electronic Dizzy for boost retard. Alot of people seem to think its the way to go, but i have no idea where to go to get it done in Sydney. Alot of places dont know what im talking bout let alone how to modify a dizzy to retard under boost.

Any ideas?

cheers
Author:  Baz [ Wed Jan 02, 2008 1:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
converting an S2 dizzy to boost retard is very difficult.
the parts you need are rare & I gave up on it a few years back.
Easy system will require you going back to a points set up.
But an old transistor ignitor will give plenty of spark.
Use a late model 180B dual point dizzy.
This system worked on advancing the ignition when NOT in the emmision range of running.
The timing was switched from the throttle plate & gear shift position.
Hook up the advance set of points as normal.
Note the timing can be set within limits for both sets of points individually.
Now hook up thro a flip flop relay the retard points to actuate of the hobbs
switch you have for the WI.
so normal off boost the ign is normal & when the WI switches as you come on boost it will then retard the ign as required.
Other wise look out for an old HKS retarder unit.
I have one on my 720 but would not have a clue where you could find one these days.
Author:  Aym23q [ Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
thanks for that Baz.
sounds like its alot of **** around really, and im not really keen on going back to a points setup..
hmm

so what about locking it then? next best thing?
Author:  Nissanman [ Wed Jan 02, 2008 3:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sounds like you need one of these.
http://www.delta-digital.com.au/
The unit was developed primarily for Petrol/LPG vehicles which require different ignition advance curves for the type of fuel being used at the time.
Anyhoo, this little box has two programmable, independent advance curves in memory.
Pin 4 allows you to switch between the two curves.
The "boost" curve could be Xdeg retarded compared to the "non boost" curve.
A manifold pressure sensor could toggle the curves when the engine went on boost.
Bottom line, you really need an Electronic Control Module of some kind :wink:
When their website is back online, check them out.
They may now produce a DELTAMAX box suitable for boosted engines
:)

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File comment: DELTAMAX Programmable Ignition System.
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File comment: Pinouts of DELTAMAX controller.
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Author:  Aym23q [ Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
hmm thanks for that nissanman, ill check it out when the site is up..
but from what u have explained that only seems to give 2 different ignition curves for ON/OFF boost - not the retardation of timing "per PSI" (like say 3 deg per psi)..

Off boost --> 15deg static, 25deg max
On boost --> 10deg static, 20 deg max

how well would that work, especially when it drops 5 degrees instantly?

also you will still have the same amount of mechanical advance right?
cheers
Author:  datones [ Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:10 am ]
Post subject: 
i looked into this a while ago and really struggled to get any good info. However i do remember reading something about boost retard on the turbo L6 from a 280zx. You may even want to have a rea of this article which has the ins and outs of dizzy regraphing. Might give you something to tinker with in the garage.

http://members.aol.com/DVAndrews/timing.htm
Author:  Nissanman [ Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:44 am ]
Post subject: 
Like I said, you really need an electronic module to do all this and perhaps look after the fuel delivery as well!!!
Haltech E series for example :idea:
Author:  Baz [ Thu Jan 03, 2008 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  points
Locking the Dizzy is a last resort.
You need advance off boost to get good light throttle performance & good boost responce.
At least redtrict the mechanical advance on the BB dizzy,
Do not worry about points as with a cheapo transistor ignitor
the points will last forever.
I have run points on boosted engines with no spark probs @ 8000 rpm.
The dual point set up is not that hard to do & its a cheap way to go.
Author:  Aym23q [ Fri Jan 04, 2008 1:58 am ]
Post subject: 
hmmm :?

You have PM Baz re: points setup.
Author:  Sanouske [ Wed May 06, 2009 10:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Boost retard on Bluebird Dizzy
can this topic have an update as to what has been used, im somewhat interested in the topic, as im dealing with this issue myself atm.

cheers
Author:  Budluvsbud [ Wed May 27, 2009 2:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Boost retard on Bluebird Dizzy
Get in contact with Allcar Automotive Engineering...(0733592219) or Stafford Tune...(0733569705) in Brisbane.
stafford Tune would probably be best as they are distributers for Motec in Australia.
Both these shops were instrumental in bringing Turbo charging into the family cars and 4WDs in the early 80s.
I worked for them then and built heaps of turbo setups for cars like telstars lasers 720s hilux landcruisers and many more.
Built my own 240k decompressed to 6:1 ...60 thou oversized...IHI turbo running external wastgate and capable of 20 lbs boost ...motor could run at 8000rpm all day every day...and did for over 2 years
Did a neat 12 seconds at 14 lb and lit up like a christmas tree from the lights. a personal record of a set of new Dunlop tyres (215/60/14) destroyedin 68 seconds. WWoooowww there was alot of smoke..lol

Any way Paul at Stafford tune would be able to help you but would be slightly disappointed at any car under around 1000 horsepower
They are into some major motor vehicle i can tell you that
Motec will have any electronic conponent you need for a car
Author:  littlefireryone [ Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Boost retard on Bluebird Dizzy
I thought I'd go dredging through the graveyard posts for some info and to perhaps "spark" some interest in this line of thought. I noticed a listing on ebay for a boost retard diaphram designed for Bosch HEI distributors (they claim Holden V8)...is not an S2 Bluebird dizzy of this type? sure as hell looks like it to me and and I plan on finding out because the bracketry looks easy enough to mod to fit onto the Bluebird Dizzy.

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Author:  Sanouske [ Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Boost retard on Bluebird Dizzy
For what its worth, jaycar sell a silicone chip designed ignition interceptor. Simply its a electric circuit board that reads the trigger signal from the "locked" dizzy and with the hand controller you can graph out your own ignition map. So you can program a strong advance curve and pull the timing out as boost climbs. It then sends the new output signal back to the dizzy for ignition firing.

It also has an option to run dual maps, which can be switched via a toggle switch. I plan to use this feature as a form of ignition cut launch control for our turbo efi l24 rally car.

Kit and hand controller are all of about $140.

Food for thought.
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